Knott's Scary Farm 2023

[ProjectScare]

can you list more interactions that you encountered in the mazes?

 

[Jake S]

As previously noted, it was Not Crowded last night. We got everything done by 9:30 p.m. and were on our way out of the park. We did one repeat (The Depths) and didn't wait for anything (we got to Room 13 at 7:15). Needless to say, I'm very glad we didn't spring for Fright Lane.

As for the event overall ... I found it pretty disappointing. I'll start with the good: the scenic for Chilling Chambers and Slaughter Cinema is extremely impressive. They pulled off visual effects in Slaughter Cinema that I just don't think they would have been capable of 10 years ago and it's great to see that kind of progression from the event.

While the event wasn't crowded, I was also impressed by how much food and beverage coverage they had throughout the park. Plenty of places to get draft beer, snacks and water, which has been a challenge at the park (day or night) previously.

But ultimately my partner and I felt the mazes were largely bereft of scares. Some of this almost certainly had to do with staffing — there were holes in multiple rooms in every maze we went through. I don't know if they understaffed in anticipation of the crowds, but many of the mazes felt quite empty. It's not a great look for opening weekend. But ultimately, even in the mazes that were better staffed (Bloodline, Room 13) I think the major flaw is in their design.

The design team came up with a lot of great environments for guests to walk through, but it appears precious little thought was given to how performers would actually scare guests once they're inside them. I've talked before about my frustrations with Knott's scaring philosophy, and those frustrations hold true, but ultimately the design team is creating rooms where performers are forced to wander around or stand in open space. There appear to be very few "designed" scaring opportunities, forcing performers to work with the space they have — obviously that can be good, but more frequently it's underwhelming.

By my count there were only two good scares in all the mazes I went through. I'm glad we went, and we had a nice time walking through scare zones while retaining our personal space, but I'm just a bit disappointed that Knott's Scary Farm seems to have little interest in actually scaring people.

 

[saint.piss]

Also, did anyone else catch Tony Baxter in the park last night? He walked past us in line for Room 13.

OMG yes I did but I forgot his name so I didn't say anything

 

[Rideguy70]

As previously noted, it was Not Crowded last night. We got everything done by 9:30 p.m. and were on our way out of the park. We did one repeat (The Depths) and didn't wait for anything (we got to Room 13 at 7:15). Needless to say, I'm very glad we didn't spring for Fright Lane.

As for the event overall ... I found it pretty disappointing. I'll start with the good: the scenic for Chilling Chambers and Slaughter Cinema is extremely impressive. They pulled off visual effects in Slaughter Cinema that I just don't think they would have been capable of 10 years ago and it's great to see that kind of progression from the event.

While the event wasn't crowded, I was also impressed by how much food and beverage coverage they had throughout the park. Plenty of places to get draft beer, snacks and water, which has been a challenge at the park (day or night) previously.

But ultimately my partner and I felt the mazes were largely bereft of scares. Some of this almost certainly had to do with staffing — there were holes in multiple rooms in every maze we went through. I don't know if they understaffed in anticipation of the crowds, but many of the mazes felt quite empty. It's not a great look for opening weekend. But ultimately, even in the mazes that were better staffed (Bloodline, Room 13) I think the major flaw is in their design.

The design team came up with a lot of great environments for guests to walk through, but it appears precious little thought was given to how performers would actually scare guests once they're inside them. I've talked before about my frustrations with Knott's scaring philosophy, and those frustrations hold true, but ultimately the design team is creating rooms where performers are forced to wander around or stand in open space. There appear to be very few "designed" scaring opportunities, forcing performers to work with the space they have — obviously that can be good, but more frequently it's underwhelming.

By my count there were only two good scares in all the mazes I went through. I'm glad we went, and we had a nice time walking through scare zones while retaining our personal space, but I'm just a bit disappointed that Knott's Scary Farm seems to have little interest in actually scaring people.

I've said this many times as well... in terms of scenic design, Knott's is really tops. Even better than HHN, IMO.

But in terms of scareactors... it can be really, really iffy. I've had some great scares in KSF mazes, but I've also had times where I've gone though an entire maze and maybe saw 1-2 scareactors total, and they barely did anything. And this is not exactly new... this has been happening since the 80s.

If there was a way to get KSF mazes paired up with HHN scareactors, that'd be the ultimate haunt event.

 

[DTH]

No way the scenic is better at Knotts. I've never been fully immersed in a maze there, pretty much ever -- nothing of a real-world matter is replicated properly. Everything is cheaper by a long shot, and looks as such too. Is it more... creative looking? Sure, but definitely not realistic looking.

It comes down to the freedom KSF gives their monsters that is the problem. And also the mazes aren't designed with scares in mind, most of the time. They'll throw in obstacles along your route for a monster to hide behind sometimes, but most of the time it's just a monster in a corner, coming around a corner, or standing by the wall. There needs to be boo holes for them to come out of or have a scare designed specifically for the room. Giving the monsters the freedom is a really huge failed experiment that hasn't worked in decades, yet they haven't ever fixed the issue. The 1% who get a unique interaction with a monster that's following them, terrorizing them, or stalking them is...fine, I guess, not my cup of tea either way, but the other 99% of people are either going without being attacked or just getting a shaker can to the face.

 

[HORRORable Commenter]

No way the scenic is better at Knotts. I've never been fully immersed in a maze there, pretty much ever -- nothing of a real-world matter is replicated properly. Everything is cheaper by a long shot, and looks as such too. Is it more... creative looking? Sure, but definitely not realistic looking.

It comes down to the freedom KSF gives their monsters that is the problem. And also the mazes aren't designed with scares in mind, most of the time. They'll throw in obstacles along your route for a monster to hide behind sometimes, but most of the time it's just a monster in a corner, coming around a corner, or standing by the wall. There needs to be boo holes for them to come out of or have a scare designed specifically for the room. Giving the monsters the freedom is a really huge failed experiment that hasn't worked in decades, yet they haven't ever fixed the issue. The 1% who get a unique interaction with a monster that's following them, terrorizing them, or stalking them is...fine, I guess, not my cup of tea either way, but the other 99% of people are either going without being attacked or just getting a shaker can to the face.

I have really mixed emotions on this. On one hand, I do think knotts is more theatrical in their designs, but they have done "real world" stuff like dark ride really well in recent years. I do agree that the mazes are commonly designed not for traditional boo scares, and I do see how that can be awkward, but also rooms like the finale of dark ride or the swamp in the depths really benefit from being open spaces actors can play around in

 

[Jake S]

I do agree that the mazes are commonly designed not for traditional boo scares, and I do see how that can be awkward, but also rooms like the finale of dark ride or the swamp in the depths really benefit from being open spaces actors can play around in

Yeah, I don't think it's an either/or proposition. Those big, open floors are absolutely benefited by roaming performers, but I tend to think those should be reserved as show-stopping set pieces and not the strategy for every room in the maze.

 

[Michael S]

Yeah, I don't think it's an either/or proposition. Those big, open floors are absolutely benefited by roaming performers, but I tend to think those should be reserved as show-stopping set pieces and not the strategy for every room in the maze.

Yeah I think the main issue is there is no variety in the realm of scare tactics. Just monsters roaming the halls or in big set pieces, like you said. Those show-stoppers would have more of an impact if the performers had built in scares (and retreats, to be real) for most of the attraction, and the big scenes would be where you can really soak everything in.

 

[Spookies n' Stuff]

On the topic of built-in scares,
It varies a lot honestly. many mazes are built to be essentially playgrounds for the monsters, with things like Dark Ride being something that comes to mind, where it's consciously made to give the monsters 2-4 different spots in any given room where they can mess around and try different things. I've seen quite a few rooms in the new mazes that are like this too.

I do wonder why not every maze is designed this way, but at a certain point I have to wonder if the location and the constraints of the physical space are a factor. Almost every single one of Knotts' mazes are built in an indoor space with fully enclosed walls, as opposed to Horror Nights where theyre all pretty much pop-up tents with their only constraints being the plot the tents are put up on. I know for a fact it isnt an issue of a designers individual personal style, since you look at the mazes of Jon Cooke, and theyre all over the place in that aspect, some are big playgrounds for the monsters like Dark Ride or Special Ops, and you have others like Origins and Depths where the scenic aspect is much more in focus, and there's only a few big built in scares and a lot of the others can be swapped around. Then of course you have to factor in that not every built in scare might work as well as is hoped, you might build a room with 3 potential scares for a performer but only 1 consistently gets a reaction, and then that performer is encouraged to keep to that one spot rather than experiment. It's a tricky balance.

 

[viking_wizard_eyes]

The actors at KSF — unless they’re one of the bungee or stunt people — don’t really have a lot of tools at their disposal. I know that part of the reason the actors roam the rooms is because there’s really no reason for them to be tied to a certain place, whereas HHN actors often have cues they need to trigger alongside their scares.

IMO, the scenic atmospherics that accompany actors at HHN are one of the biggest reasons it’s a more successful and satisfying event/experience. An actor jumping out is almost always accompanied by flashing lights and loud noise and voices on the soundtrack — which, per my previous point, is a thousand times more effective than a guy growling or yelling something at you.

Also, for what it’s worth, I fully expect the small crowds to last well through the season.

 

[chris.g]

I've said it before I've always thought KSF sucked lol

 

[viking_wizard_eyes]

I don’t think it sucks, but people definitely overrate it like crazy. I think if you’re active in the horror and theme park community, saying you think KSF is better than HHN is definitely the “hip” take.

Both events succeed and fail on their individual merits. They have different strengths and weaknesses. But I think KSF phones it in way more frequently, and it’s starting to get really bad/noticeable. That’s why I think the crowds are gonna be pretty thin.

Like, I watched the Ordinary Adventures vlog about this year’s KSF and they were very lukewarm — but they tend to love everything, right? I’m pretty sure they could get mugged in a maze but as long as it was themed well, they’d still be like “That was great, 10/10.” So idk, there’s definitely a shift happening.

 

[Jake S]

I think if you’re active in the horror and theme park community, saying you think KSF is better than HHN is definitely the “hip” take.

I'm curious what other's experience is with this, but I also find many locals my age (early 30s) have a similar take. Some of this is certainly nostalgia as many people my age have found memories of going to Scary Farm in junior high/high school, but I'm not sure that's all of it.

that said, given how soft attendance was last year and appears to be this year... something is definitely amiss.

 

[HORRORable Commenter]

I've said it before I've always thought KSF sucked lol

We don't have to be dicks about it, dude

 

[ProjectScare]

Why does room 13 have one of the longest wait times? Is it because they have a preshow I thought about this but haven't heard any information yet.

 

[Jake S]

Why does room 13 have one of the longest wait times? Is it because they have a preshow I thought about this but haven't heard any information yet.

I'm honestly not sure. There's no pre-show to speak of, so it may just be that they're not pulsing as efficiently at this location or that people tend to walk through it more slowly than other mazes.

 

[AlexanderMBush]

We don't have to be dicks about it, dude

Different strokes for different folks--honestly I actually commend Chris for being blunt.

that said, given how soft attendance was last year and appears to be this year... something is definitely amiss.

I wonder if this comes down to perhaps--things not *clicking* in a way that resonates to the younger adult/teen audiences that other events like Oogie Boogie Bash and HHN have?

 

[Wishmaster]

The actors at KSF — unless they’re one of the bungee or stunt people — don’t really have a lot of tools at their disposal. I know that part of the reason the actors roam the rooms is because there’s really no reason for them to be tied to a certain place, whereas HHN actors often have cues they need to trigger alongside their scares.

IMO, the scenic atmospherics that accompany actors at HHN are one of the biggest reasons it’s a more successful and satisfying event/experience. An actor jumping out is almost always accompanied by flashing lights and loud noise and voices on the soundtrack — which, per my previous point, is a thousand times more effective than a guy growling or yelling something at you.

Also, for what it’s worth, I fully expect the small crowds to last well through the season.

I have no problem with small crowds cause it’s the opposite of HHN

I've said it before I've always thought KSF sucked lol

this is his honest opinion. When did it become a problem to be blunt. I disagree with this but I respect it. I thought KSF ‘22 was better than HHN ‘22 but I thought HHN ‘21 was better than KSF ‘22 (by edge). We have no issue slandering FF or HHN when they do repeats so it shouldn’t be a problem giving an honest opinion about other events.

 

[viking_wizard_eyes]

I wonder if this comes down to perhaps--things not *clicking* in a way that resonates to the younger adult/teen audiences that other events like Oogie Boogie Bash and HHN have?

I mean, the chaperone policy quite literally prevents a lot of young adults and teens from attending, but I do think the lack of IP is a factor.

However, much more than that, I think the reason crowds are slow to begin the season is because KSF is not a great return event. Like yes, HHN will repeat houses, or they'll repeat IPs in new houses, but year over year, KSF is essentially the exact same experience. And even when HHN brings a house back, the quality is upheld. That is decidedly not the case at KSF. Not only are the existing houses literally exactly the same, but they usually have less actors; the scenic is noticeably old and unkempt. All the focus goes on the newer houses, which results in an uneven event.

So I think people are kinda starting to wise up to that. I skipped last year in hopes that coming this year would help the event feel more fresh, and while it kinda did, the houses from last year (Grimoire + Bloodline) already feel like afterthoughts. Were Cinema Slasher and Chilling Chamber great? Totally. But when you get two good mazes, one that's so-so, and seven others that are not only 100% identical to the previous year's event but actively degrading in quality, you're not gonna see a lot of people lining up for that.

 

[HORRORable Commenter]

I have no problem with small crowds cause it’s the opposite of HHN

this is his honest opinion. When did it become a problem to be blunt. I disagree with this but I respect it. I thought KSF ‘22 was better than HHN ‘22 but I thought HHN ‘21 was better than KSF ‘22 (by edge). We have no issue slandering FF or HHN when they do repeats so it shouldn’t be a problem giving an honest opinion about other events.

This is just personal opinion, but I don't think language like "always sucked" has any elegance or articulation that makes it worth more than the emotional harm it inflicts on the large communities that put these events together. Additionally, this is my opinion it's kind of a dickish thing to say. It's real easy to say something sucks and not engage actively try and engage with it in greater terms. Are these events capitalist products: yes. Are they also the culmination of year long efforts between creative teams who probably exist in the very small ponds us fans do? Yes