Epic Universe Expansion Speculation

[Mike S]

When folks from colder climates go to Florida they want to be outside. Doesn’t excuse exposed queues and lack of shade, but it does why folks want rides outside. Good example of this is my friends who once skipped doing trader Sam’s indoors to sit outside since it was FL.

Meanwhile as someone that lives here I wouldn’t mind if the entire park was somehow indoors

 

[UniversalRBLX]

There's been a pretty noticeable decline in park crowd levels in the summer months. Combination of price increases, hot weather, alternative summer vacations like Cruising, etc. We will see what happens this summer, but it's been very soft. 2025 seems to be following this trend with TouringPlans reporting lower crowd levels than what they had estimated so far this month.


Thanks to TouringPlans for the data (data only available since 2015).

It's even more shocking at WDW...


People love coming to Florida for the warm sunny sun... but I think there's a limit to how much someone can handle.

 

[Mad Dog]

There's been a pretty noticeable decline in park crowd levels in the summer months. Combination of price increases, hot weather, alternative summer vacations like Cruising, etc. We will see what happens this summer, but it's been very soft. 2025 seems to be following this trend with TouringPlans reporting lower crowd levels than what they had estimated so far this month.

View attachment 27245
Thanks to TouringPlans for the data (data only available since 2015).

It's even more shocking at WDW...
View attachment 27246

People love coming to Florida for the warm sunny sun... but I think there's a limit to how much someone can handle.

Yes. Look at DHS/MK/Epcot. Most everything major is indoors.

 

[OrlandoGuy]

When folks from colder climates go to Florida they want to be outside. Doesn’t excuse exposed queues and lack of shade, but it does why folks want rides outside. Good example of this is my friends who once skipped doing trader Sam’s indoors to sit outside since it was FL.

Lol, what? These rides are like 4-5 minutes long…they can be built indoors to give parks better inclement weather capacity while allowing people to spend the majority of their days outside in the Florida hellscape.

 

[Jones14]

Not a bad shout. Reminds me of when IoA added flying unicorn and storm force within a year to address the perceived lack of smaller family attractions

That was my inspo, actually. Quick and cheap compared to major attractions, but meaningful additions nonetheless.

 

[Disneyhead]

International visitors have disappeared. Canadians, Brits, and South Americans that would normally be filling the parks are not coming to the U.S.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

Yes. Look at DHS/MK/Epcot. Most everything major is indoors.

And what was the major complaint with USF? No outdoor rides/thrill rides/water rides so they built IOA. Epcot no thrill rides our outdoor attractions so they built Test Track (and WoL for the first bit). DHS just built an all outdoor land!

Now I admit it's all anecdotal, but it's not unheard of for amusement and theme parks to be mostly outdoors.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

International visitors have disappeared. Canadians, Brits, and South Americans that would normally be filling the parks are not coming to the U.S.

That explains the massive drop this year, but there's a noticeable downturn trend in the summer months for several years now. 2024's international travel numbers were equal to that of 2018 and 2019.

 

[Alicia]

International visitors have disappeared. Canadians, Brits, and South Americans that would normally be filling the parks are not coming to the U.S.

This is why the huge push for families with kids and special deals for FL residents at WDW this summer. Never seen kids get in free ticket packages for Disney in my entire life. Plus new limited time offerings to entice AP holders, and new shows etc. Big push in local marketing. Maybe not enough to fill the gap of course.

 

[OrlLover]

International visitors have disappeared. Canadians, Brits, and South Americans that would normally be filling the parks are not coming to the U.S.

They are definitely still coming but not in large numbers to the parks.

 

[Mad Dog]

Epcot has apx. 30 seconds of Test Track outdoors, the rest is indoors. Moana's outdoor walk through. That's it...
.DHS has Slinky. They also have that alien 50 second flat ride. But that's under a roof. Everything else is indoors or a large theater under a roof with cooling fans. ..
.MK has a good mix of indoor and outdoor attractions. But they have more than double the attractions that Epic has. There's plenty of indoor & under a roof attractions to deal with hot or rainy weather.......

AK is a zoo, so it's mostly hot and steamy outdoors. But they also have two/three indoor shows and three indoor rides....
Then there's Epic. Three indoor rides and two indoor shows. The other eight attractions are outdoors, with outdoor queues too. At least the carousel is under a roof.

Disney understands people from the north wants some experiences outdoors, but then there's the reality of extreme heat and rain....
.and, on the other matter, the lack of international visitors, who were always a huge percentage of summer and September visitors is a major problem. Those visitors spend lots of money (on site hotels/food/drinks/merchandise/tickets). They are a real economic multiplier effect....
and I wonder how the Epic hotels will be doing now that the initial package purchase is probably winding down.....
Expansion really needs some high capacity indoor attractions.

 

[Skold]

I'm going to set up a GoFundMe to get Mad Dog a keyboard that has a functioning Enter key.

Love ya man, but come on.

 

[UAN17]

International visitors have disappeared. Canadians, Brits, and South Americans that would normally be filling the parks are not coming to the U.S.

And yet so far, the prices haven’t come down on hotel/flight packages to draw people back in, in the U.K. anyway. Especially considering the relatively decent pound to dollar.

I’d say there’s slightly more ticket discounts from Universal and Disney via resellers, though, which was largely unheard of outside of Black Friday a few years ago

 

[HHN Maddux]

Ideas for the new hotels (whenever they come)- Have each be themed to one of the lands. Celestial Park already has Helios, why not the others?:

Hotel Delfino (Super Nintendo World) - The luxury beachside resort from Super Mario Sunshine. Cabana Bay but a bit fancier. Have the main pool be a mini water park (think what Nickelodeon Suites had) that's entirely themed to Super Mario Sunshine.

Castle Dracula (Dark Universe) - A gothic deluxe resort that if put in the right spot, you'd be able to see from Darkmoor, lurking in the distance. Full fancy vampire restaurant with a ballroom (think Be Our Guest but, y'know, way better!). Grand Floridian, but spooky.

Beauxbatons (Ministry of Magic) - The wizard's school in France, and already kinda looks like a resort in the films. Slam dunk!

Dragon's Rest (Isle of Berk) - A more value/moderate resort entirely themed to being a resting lodge for the dragons of the world! Aesthetic-wise, I'm thinking Caribbean Beach but more viking-themed.

 

[Mike S]

Hotel Delfino (Super Nintendo World) - The luxury beachside resort from Super Mario Sunshine. Cabana Bay but a bit fancier. Have the main pool be a mini water park (think what Nickelodeon Suites had) that's entirely themed to Super Mario Sunshine.

SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!!!

 

[simon]

Ideas for the new hotels (whenever they come)- Have each be themed to one of the lands. Celestial Park already has Helios, why not the others?:

Hotel Delfino (Super Nintendo World) - The luxury beachside resort from Super Mario Sunshine. Cabana Bay but a bit fancier. Have the main pool be a mini water park (think what Nickelodeon Suites had) that's entirely themed to Super Mario Sunshine.

Castle Dracula (Dark Universe) - A gothic deluxe resort that if put in the right spot, you'd be able to see from Darkmoor, lurking in the distance. Full fancy vampire restaurant with a ballroom (think Be Our Guest but, y'know, way better!). Grand Floridian, but spooky.

Beauxbatons (Ministry of Magic) - The wizard's school in France, and already kinda looks like a resort in the films. Slam dunk!

Dragon's Rest (Isle of Berk) - A more value/moderate resort entirely themed to being a resting lodge for the dragons of the world! Aesthetic-wise, I'm thinking Caribbean Beach but more viking-themed.

I think Ministry of Magic hotel would work really well just like what other theme parks did with their area like Disney Sea's Miracosta and Phantasialand's Charles Lindbergh. They can utilize the Harry Potter expansion area as a hotel and put the Hogwarts dining experience as one of the accommodations.

 

[DrStarlander]

I think Ministry of Magic hotel would work really well just like what other theme parks did with their area like Disney Sea's Miracosta and Phantasialand's Charles Lindbergh. They can utilize the Harry Potter expansion area as a hotel and put the Hogwarts dining experience as one of the accommodations.

They could put a hotel on top of an attraction show building if they wanted. It would be like instead of having a ballroom.

 

[Disneyhead]

I don't think Universal is looking at more hotel rooms in the foreseeable future.

 

[Mad Dog]

I don't think Universal is looking at more hotel rooms in the foreseeable future.

It would be interesting to see how they're filling their rooms now that Epic opening month is past. Damn, they have a lot of rooms now. Before CBBR, it was under 2,000 rooms in the three deluxe hotels. They've come a long way.....maybe a tad too far even.

 

[maxairmike]

And what was the major complaint with USF? No outdoor rides/thrill rides/water rides so they built IOA. Epcot no thrill rides our outdoor attractions so they built Test Track (and WoL for the first bit). DHS just built an all outdoor land!

Now I admit it's all anecdotal, but it's not unheard of for amusement and theme parks to be mostly outdoors.

I’ve never heard a single person once say they wanted more outdoor rides, only that they wanted more thrill rides if anything. The only time I’ve ever heard the outdoor sentiment is regarding the idea of indoor water parks (yes I’m still disappointed the Great Wolf development never happened), and I still don’t entirely agree that it’s not a winning idea down here. Even if a small group of people have said they wanted more outdoor attractions specifically, they would also be the first to grouse about them not being available and there being not enough to do during inclement weather.

I don’t think there’s some innate desire for outdoor attractions specifically, but rather most mid to high thrill rides tend to be outdoors because of mechanical/space/budget constraints, so there’s an expectation that outdoor=thrill. Epic objectively needs more “indoor” attraction capacity, and at least one or two should probably be higher thrill than most covered flats would be, something more along the lines of Mummy or Gringotts.